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  • Please help me!!

    hello!

    i am writing from germany and are a little bit confused whilst reading the book. i think the translation into german is bit weak and i dont understand the a-z files.

    i just dont know in which files i have to put my documents! I dont know how such a file look like!! (That sound a bit silly i think). they translated it into "Aktenordner" but this is something completely different.

    My question is if somebody coud take a picture from his file system so i will understand the whole story!


    thank you very much in advance.

    Paul

  • #2
    Dear Paul:

    I took a picture but do not know how to post it to the forum.

    In Europe, it is typical to keep papers in binders (Aktenordner) but in the US, we use file folders more than binders. Binders stand upright on shelves and have rings that pass through holes in the pages. File folders are U-shaped pieces of thick paper into which normal pages are placed. File folders cannot stand upright but are place long, closed side down into drawers.

    We put a label on each folder with the theme. We put the folders in the drawer in alphabetical order by first letter of the subject. In English, alphabetical order is called A-Z.

    Here is a link to a picture of file folders.

    http://www.pendaflex.com/Americas/index.html

    I will try in German but please forgive my bad German.

    Zum beispiel, Sie haben einen Brief Ueber Fotographie. Sie setzten ihn in ein Heft (file folder) mit Fotographie als Thema ein. Ordnen Sie alle Hefte in alphabetischer Reihenfolge ein. Das heisst "A-Z" auf Englisch.

    I hope this helps.
    Ken

    Comment


    • #3
      Hello from the states...

      Hello Paul,

      Out of curiosity...where are you located? I will be working in Cologne and Munich this month...

      Please let me know!

      As far as filing is concerned, Marian Bateman (on our staff) has done a lot of work in London with banking clients. All of us coaches have experience walking them through this information: http://www.davidco.com/pdfs/tt_filing.pdf


      Hope that helps! Please feel free to contact us directly with any more information: info@davidco.com

      Jason

      Comment


      • #4
        Another thread here with some information and links about file folders is:

        http://www.davidco.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=52

        Regards,
        Ken

        Comment


        • #5
          Bad translation

          Yes, I stumbled upon that too - putting my stuff into binders sounded very awful. But this is only a bad translation.

          So here is a rough translation table from english to "bad" german to "real" german:

          folder/manila folder -> Ordner -> Mappe/Einschlagmappe/Einstellmappe
          hanging files/folders -> Hängeordner -> Hängeregistratur

          The links don't work anymore, maybe somebody can update them.

          Now I only need to know what the strange word "Handakte" means.

          Comment


          • #6
            Wrong translation of file, project

            Originally posted by archangel77
            Now I only need to know what the strange word "Handakte" means.
            That one is easy:
            "Handakte" means a personal reference file that you keep at your working place instead of at a central registry. You have those files "at hand", so to say. Such a "Handakte" may be only part of a file in a central collection and contain only that part of information you need frequently or for an actual purpose.

            I agree that translating file into "Ordner" may be misleading. It should have been "Ablagemappe". I use those from Leitz, the order number is "2434". There may be other excellent sources, among those is Mappei.

            There is still another expression that is translated rather misleading. Project is translated into the german "Projekt" which is wrong, to say the least. It should have been translated into "Vorgang".

            Hope this helps,
            Volker

            Comment


            • #7
              [GTD_Tools] File Folders

              Originally posted by Kurz
              I agree that translating file into "Ordner" may be misleading. It should have been "Ablagemappe". I use those from Leitz, the order number is "2434". There may be other excellent sources, among those is Mappei.
              An other source is http://www.schaefer-shop.de/ where you can buy "Atlanta Einschiebmappen".

              Originally posted by Kurz
              There is still another expression that is translated rather misleading. Project is translated into the german "Projekt" which is wrong, to say the least. It should have been translated into "Vorgang".
              Both German words "Vorgang" and "Vorhaben" can be used to translate the word "project", depending on the situation.

              Regards
              Rainer

              Comment


              • #8
                [GTD_Tools] Handakte, Reference File

                Originally posted by Kurz
                "Handakte" means a personal reference file that you keep at your working place instead of at a central registry. You have those files "at hand", so to say. Such a "Handakte" may be only part of a file in a central collection and contain only that part of information you need frequently or for an actual purpose.
                Yes, and the English term is "reference file" or "general reference file". David Allen recommends A-Z filing for this kind of files.

                Rainer

                Comment


                • #9
                  Paul,
                  It seems like your English is very good--it might be simpler to just read the book in English! Then you could also contact DA and point out some of the translation problems. I'm sure they are very interested in translation issues that cause problems with gtd.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Real manila folders in Germany?

                    Hi,

                    I'm also in Germany and looking for appropriate file folders for gtd. The Leitz 2434 seems to have removable plastic tabs. That is not very practical as they tend to fall out when you carry folders around. I'd prefer real plain US-style manila file folders with a paper tab on top. Does anyone know where these (and appropriate filing cabinets) can be ordered in Germany?

                    Thanks,

                    Branimir

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by bdolicki
                      I'm also in Germany and looking for appropriate file folders for gtd. The Leitz 2434 seems to have removable plastic tabs. That is not very practical as they tend to fall out when you carry folders around. I'd prefer real plain US-style manila file folders with a paper tab on top. Does anyone know where these (and appropriate filing cabinets) can be ordered in Germany?
                      The 2434 which are still used in our office have no plastic tabs.

                      Quoting myself:

                      Originally posted by hth
                      I know of three main suppliers in Germany:

                      My favourite! Since I know them, I have phased out my other folders:
                      http://www.classei.de/
                      -You position the tabs alphabetically or as you like.
                      -They have different folders thicknesses for various number of pages.
                      -For a first try you can order a "Praxiskit":
                      http://www.classei.de/praxiskit.htm

                      Other sources:
                      http://www.leitz.de/
                      -For all of us who identify Leitz with upright folders. They sell tabbed manila folders as well. You can find them on their German language Website; product number is: 2434. They are not listed on the English Site!
                      -Five different tab-positions

                      http://www.schaefer-shop.de/
                      Look here:
                      "Startseite > Bürobedarf > Registermappen, -körbe > Einschiebmappen"
                      -Three different tab-positions
                      Yours
                      Alexander

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        binders vs folders

                        First, form should follow the function. But, I also think that some psychology is involved in regard to how the materials you use "feel" and what they convey psychologically. I know that generalizations are often not useful but perhaps if they make one think about what one is trying to maximize they might help one make a better choice as they might be a useful starting point for thinking. I think that folders, because they are easy to fill and it is so easy to accumulate more and more of them, might somehow reflect the American mythical sense of space as an endless resource. In contrast, maybe it is more European to think more carefully about what is being saved, with a guiding belief that efficient use of space is an ideal in itself, even although it is a lot harder to in some ways to be efficient. We all know how many extra steps it takes to put things in binders with hole punching or clamps. That being said, I do believe that for frequently used information, or a corpus that is fairly static or has a defined "updates" that supercede some existing portion (like monthly reports where one comes in and the oldest is thrown out), it is a lot easier to utilize a binder once it has been made. At one point I had about 100 references articles in binders (between 5 and 8 per binder, with related notes) and it made the project I was working on much easier from a retrieval and cross-checking viewpoint, so I know something about working with binders. However, if one has a lot of in flow or great piles to process and organize then folders are easier and as a first step it is a great thing to not have to think about organizing at any level higher than A to Z. but, later after using the A to Z sytem, one might find that certain groups of folders are often pulled out together(e.g., xmas recipes, xmas lighting scheme, gifts given to relatives in the past) and it might make sense to put these in a sectioned binder or even sectioned folder. I think one can work with either and in the ideal system, one might have both.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Plain manila file folders are known as Leitz 2443 Einstellmappe

                          If you are looking for a plain manila file folder: Search Google for "Leitz 2443". That's it.

                          Best regards,
                          Florian

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Reichl View Post
                            If you are looking for a plain manila file folder: Search Google for "Leitz 2443". That's it.
                            Wow, those are expensive. The next time I spend an extended period of time in Germany I'll have to remember to bring my own manilla folders from the U.S (though, unfortunately, they don't quite fit A4 paper).

                            appr. 4 US Dollars for 100
                            vs.
                            appr. 20 Euros for 100

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by madalu View Post
                              Wow, those are expensive. The next time I spend an extended period of time in Germany I'll have to remember to bring my own manilla folders from the U.S (though, unfortunately, they don't quite fit A4 paper).

                              appr. 4 US Dollars for 100
                              vs.
                              appr. 20 Euros for 100
                              You're right. The problem is that "Einstellmappen" (folders as described in GTD) are not very common in Germany and there is only one company (Leitz) that I know that sells them.

                              If you search Google for the products you find that they start from about 13 Euro/100 folders.
                              http://www.google.de/products?q=leit...um=1&scoring=p

                              Best regards,
                              Florian

                              Comment

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