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  • Franklin Covey / GTD

    Does anyone use a combination of the two systems??
    I love GTD's next action thought process..I've been involved with GTD from the onset...The lists are a big problem for me...I simply get more done by making a list for the day...I know this goes against the grain of GTD. I have no problem with @ Home...It's the business stuff.
    Also, I rely on the record of what actualy happened today...who promised me what...what milestones were met...etc...
    Hope I've made myself clear and I would appreciate any suggestions...
    Thanks

  • #2
    Originally posted by steve beal View Post
    Does anyone use a combination of the two systems??
    I love GTD's next action thought process..I've been involved with GTD from the onset...The lists are a big problem for me...I simply get more done by making a list for the day...I know this goes against the grain of GTD. I have no problem with @ Home...It's the business stuff.
    Also, I rely on the record of what actualy happened today...who promised me what...what milestones were met...etc...
    Hope I've made myself clear and I would appreciate any suggestions...
    Thanks
    Hey Steve,

    A name I remember from days past on the board.

    "I simply get more done by making a list for the day.."

    GTD has many excellent things: waiting for, next actions, 2 min rule, etc. However the way David deals with priorities doesn't work for me either. I'm not sure if I get MORE done making daily lists, but I get more important stuff done consistently making daily lists. What David suggests works for many but clearly not all people.

    By "combination of the two systems??" What are you taking from Covey?

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by steve beal View Post
      Does anyone use a combination of the two systems??
      Thanks
      Absolutely! But projects and next actions get so much attention that Covey is overlooked.

      GTD talks about runway (next actions), 10000 feet (projects), 20000 feet (areas of focus), and goes even higher.

      However, stop at areas of focus; on page 205, Getting Things Done defines 'areas of focus' as 'hats' or 'roles'. This is the Covey level.

      Regards,
      Rob

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by steve beal View Post
        Does anyone use a combination of the two systems??
        The lists are a big problem for me...I simply get more done by making a list for the day...I know this goes against the grain of GTD. IThanks
        Sorry -- I should have read your question more carefully. Covey and GTD have a similar approach to lists -- they both teach using a weekly list, not a daily one.

        However, if you were to poll GTD users, I think you would find that at the start of their day, or at the start of a particular context for the day (such as @work), they go through their weekly list and identify what they want to tackle today. That subset of items is then focused on for the day.

        So, it is basically what you are doing -- whether you are making a list for the day, or whether you are flagging a subset of next actions for the day, or whether you are somehow pulling a subset of next actions to the top of your weekly list, or whether you use post-it notes for what is important for thhe day, the majority of GTD people make daily lists.

        People, please correct me if I am wrong.

        Regards,
        Rob

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by ArcCaster View Post
          Sorry -- I should have read your question more carefully. Covey and GTD have a similar approach to lists -- they both teach using a weekly list, not a daily one.
          You have to be careful about what you mean by "Covey" because Franklin-Covey was formed by the merger of two organizations. Covey (the man) had very high name recognition, and emphasized some very popular concepts, such as "big rocks" and "roles." On the other hand, most people did not find Covey's ideas very helpful on a day-to-day basis. Franklin, headed by Hyrum Smith, had a focus on day-to-day planning, but with an emphasis on top-down prioritization. The Franklin planner method was not so easy to follow, and if you "fell off the wagon" it was hard to get back on. Since the merger, I don't thing there has really been a coherent philosophy or planning method.

          However, if you were to poll GTD users, I think you would find that at the start of their day, or at the start of a particular context for the day (such as @work), they go through their weekly list and identify what they want to tackle today. That subset of items is then focused on for the day.

          So, it is basically what you are doing -- whether you are making a list for the day, or whether you are flagging a subset of next actions for the day, or whether you are somehow pulling a subset of next actions to the top of your weekly list, or whether you use post-it notes for what is important for thhe day, the majority of GTD people make daily lists.

          People, please correct me if I am wrong.
          I think the majority of GTD people make daily lists sometimes, but different people have different needs. The checklist for the day I leave on a long trip is different from the list of tasks on my calendar that I must do today, and that list is different from the things on my next action list that I would really like to do. You might have a system that allows you to star or flag a next action, as I do. But that's not my list of things I have to do, or even will do. The conceptual difference with the Franklin Prioritized Daily Task List may be subtle, but it is real.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by ArcCaster View Post
            So, it is basically what you are doing -- whether you are making a list for the day, or whether you are flagging a subset of next actions for the day, or whether you are somehow pulling a subset of next actions to the top of your weekly list, or whether you use post-it notes for what is important for thhe day, the majority of GTD people make daily lists.
            For me it is a question of whether it goes on a next action list or on the calendar. I put block time on the calendar for the high priority actions. With that I don't feel that I need a daily list.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by ArcCaster View Post
              So, it is basically what you are doing -- whether you are making a list for the day, or whether you are flagging a subset of next actions for the day, or whether you are somehow pulling a subset of next actions to the top of your weekly list, or whether you use post-it notes for what is important for thhe day, the majority of GTD people make daily lists.
              What's a daily list? The Franklin people recommend creation of a prioritized action list *every* *single* *day.* That is *not* the same thing as scribbling a few reminders on a sticky note when one day looks especially chaotic.

              It may be true that most people (GTD-oriented or not) use some form of daily list some of the time. That does *not* mean that most GTD users incorporate the Franklin methodology. Certainly DA himself explicitly rejects the daily planning approach.

              Katherine

              Comment


              • #8
                First, I'm flat out amazed by the fact that people are so willing to help ( I live and work in N.Y.C!)
                I've been a list maker since age 12.
                7 Habits changed my life when it came out.
                Hyrum's book took it further.
                I found it interesting that Covey advocated weekly / not daily planning until the merge.
                Hyrum and Covey seem to get into the headier stuff. Values, Roles, Goals, Big Rocks..etc...while David talks about filling your stapler.
                I've read 7 habits a dozen times, Hyrum Smith's book at least three times, GDT about 5 or 6 times. Listed to the 16 cassette thing from GTD when it first came out at leasttwice all the way through. (I think it's still in my garage).
                I switch from digital to paper at least once every two months.
                I'm exhausted!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by steve beal View Post
                  I switch from digital to paper at least once every two months.
                  I'm exhausted!
                  I feel your pain. I switch between a Compact Time/Design binder, Natara Bonsai on Desktop and on my Palm TX, Agendus desktop/Agendus on TX, Palm Desktop and Datebk6 on my TX, get frustrated with everything, go back to paper, try the "Do It Tomorrow" time management scheme, then back to GTD, then get frustrated with paper and back to the software cycle again. What's the definition of insanity again?....

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by plaid View Post
                    What's the definition of insanity again?....
                    Ah, but the definition of an optimist is one who does the same thing hoping that this time the results will be better.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Write it down!

                      The last two/three posts in the thread talk about having to switch between systems too often. What I would like to say is this:

                      Whenever you feel the urge to change your system from A to B, write down all the reasons. They will obviously include reasons why you think system B is better than system A. If this is the first time you are writing, do make a switch. Preserve the written reasons.

                      Next time you feel you were better off using system A (or even a third system C) rather than the current one (B), again write down the reasons. This time it will include why you think system A is better. But now you have something better for making the decision: the reasons why you chose system B over A. Now keep both the lists of reasons in front of you, and you will be able to make an objective decision. It may even be a combination, or something creative.

                      Even though you will never stop tweaking your systems, if you have your reasons dumped down, you can make progress and improve your way or working rather than moving in circles. Instead of going through the pain of switching the system back and forth and re-realizing the same reasons again and again, it will recall the reasons for you even before you make the switch.

                      (Now, that's GTD again! Write things down, and make executive decisions about it!)

                      Hope this helps,
                      Regards,
                      Abhay

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Optimist = Banjo Player with a Mortgage...
                        Back to the subject at hand.
                        Over the years, I've had great success with GTD. I do believe that if I don't take care of my in box, my sock drawer etc...and I fail to capture everything that comes across my mind that needs to be done at some point, I'll not be in any condition to plan the big stuff. I also believe that no matter how carefully I plan my day, and no matter how much flex time I allow, the moment the phone rings, it often goes down the drain leaving me at the end of the day with a list of things I didn't do and the job of re-writing it for tomorrow.
                        Planning daily really makes little sense. Putting things on my calendar that are time specific is easy. what about all of the other tasks that will become urgent tomorrow if I don't do them today? It seems silly to put those on my calendar, so a daily list begins to make some sense.
                        Sometimes, I show up and just begin doing the things that I know are improtant without even looking at my list(s). These are the best days for me. There is a part of me that knows that nothing else on my list comes close to the job i'm involved with. That, of course is a result of GTD methodoligy.

                        So, there is little doubt that GTD has trained my thinking quite a bit to get it all out of my head and follow my intuition without too much stress or worry. Or as david calls it, walking around dumb and happy.

                        I think, however, that if I had to create a "waiting for" item each time someone says "I'll get back to you", I'd have a thousand a day. By the time I get around to scanning that list, most of the items are outdated and the writing it down on a list seems to have been a waste of time.

                        I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. As I said, I know daily planning creates alot re-writing because life happens, but I still feel that I get more done when I put it all in front of me each day and leave nothing buried in a separate lsit somewhere.
                        I remain a work in progress - slow learner, but never a quitter.
                        Thanks for all the help.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by steve beal View Post
                          Planning daily really makes little sense. ...what about all of the other tasks that will become urgent tomorrow if I don't do them today?
                          It is tempting to say that you need a new job/occupation.

                          Are these jobs that need to be done today that will be urgent tomorrow otherwise some kind of thing you can predict either because of routine, or same type of thing you do week in week out, or one offs?

                          I acutally assigned each one of my projects into one of Covey's 4 quadrants (found the form at that DYI form site) and I found that helpful, but perhaps your job moves too fast and you need to think of the fly which quadrant something is in as it happens to you.
                          Last edited by ScottL; 11-15-2008, 06:20 AM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Constuction Management in New York City. I see people walking from the subway at 9 A.M. with their Starbucks bag. By that time, I've been in three meetings.
                            I do love my job and would never settle for one less demanding but sometimes I envy blue collar guys who put up sheetrock all day. David talks about this (widgets).
                            I think my problem stems from the worst form of procrastination. No real integrity in the moment of choice.
                            I'll work on that.
                            Thank You Abhay...I will write down the reasons for dropping a sysytem at the moment I drop it.
                            As for today, I will do a weekly review, purge my pencil drawer, collect, process, and organize. Hopefully, by Monday I will be attracted to my list(s) and not repelled by them because I will have drilled down to next physical action on everything.
                            At least that's the plan. I can always go for a run and do it all tomorrow.
                            Can anyone Identify with that?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              franklin covey /GTD

                              This is a very interesting discussion, the difference between these two methods. For me and a guess many others 90% of my things to do is @work and 70% @computer, making others lits like @home and @sometime/maybe wery small. this implies that most next actions has to be done at work during a work day or during a work week. This is how franklin covey reccomends people to plan with dayly tasks and a weekly compass. Stephen Coveys methods are by far more profound than Dave Allens. Just think about the 4th of the 7 habits "always think win win, if not possible then no deal". If bank managers and finacial advisors had thought thought about this and not their own greed, things would have been a lot different now.

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